Thursday, June 30, 2005
Transience & agnosticism
Just added my favourite non-famous blogger to my blog roll of 2 - Transience of To Norway on a Bicycle. First came across her by next blogging from my site & her animated .gif of Bjork caught my eye - her site looks cooler than mine overall. Believe she lives in the Philippines - part of the attraction of blogs must be the same attraction of Ham radios, meeting folks on the other side of the planet with similar interests that you'd never meet otherwise. Recently she mentioned that she was an agnostic: having gone from being an agnostic in my 20's to being a deist now I counseled her that she'd do the same. Not sure when I made the conversion, but some time shortly after my religious experience on the 17 mile drive back in my early 20's.
Believe that no human can go through life with an undecided belief concerning God. What makes humans agnostic are the existing religions: I never believed in the Christian god or the Jewish god, and that left me doubting God's existence. In actuality I was not doubting God's existence, but instead doubting the existence of God as presented by the extant religions.
When I've stated to the Ginger Haired Yank that I believe in God, her immediate response is "you believe in a white bearded father figure giving birth to man!" No, no, no. Unfortunately when you say you believe in God, what comes to mind are the images propagated by the planet's dominant religions.
Read that one of our founders viewed atheism & deism to be the same. Can tell from personal experience how false that belief is: One night fellow deist & ex-roommate Big Boy & I were having a semi-heated argument with our spouses & Gator Boy (all devout atheists). Anyone listening in would never consider deism & atheism to be the same. Of course beliefs of God are so core to our being that you'll never convince an adult to change their beliefs, so Gator Boy wasn't convince to convert by my bit of sophistry that "infinity is just another name for God" even though I believe it's true.
Too bad the term Deism isn't better known - Big Boy was arguing with his father-in-law, but didn't have the correct term to express his argument and either used agnosticism or atheism to inaccurately describe his religious belief.
Final Thought: Hands down my favourite film image of God has to be from Acid House. The first story's protagonist meets God & tells him that he's "just like i imagined you." "Of course i'm like you imagined me ya daft cunt, that's because I look just like you imagined me - yuv got no imagination" (paraphrase). Will leave final line to Welsh:
Believe that no human can go through life with an undecided belief concerning God. What makes humans agnostic are the existing religions: I never believed in the Christian god or the Jewish god, and that left me doubting God's existence. In actuality I was not doubting God's existence, but instead doubting the existence of God as presented by the extant religions.
When I've stated to the Ginger Haired Yank that I believe in God, her immediate response is "you believe in a white bearded father figure giving birth to man!" No, no, no. Unfortunately when you say you believe in God, what comes to mind are the images propagated by the planet's dominant religions.
Read that one of our founders viewed atheism & deism to be the same. Can tell from personal experience how false that belief is: One night fellow deist & ex-roommate Big Boy & I were having a semi-heated argument with our spouses & Gator Boy (all devout atheists). Anyone listening in would never consider deism & atheism to be the same. Of course beliefs of God are so core to our being that you'll never convince an adult to change their beliefs, so Gator Boy wasn't convince to convert by my bit of sophistry that "infinity is just another name for God" even though I believe it's true.
Too bad the term Deism isn't better known - Big Boy was arguing with his father-in-law, but didn't have the correct term to express his argument and either used agnosticism or atheism to inaccurately describe his religious belief.
Final Thought: Hands down my favourite film image of God has to be from Acid House. The first story's protagonist meets God & tells him that he's "just like i imagined you." "Of course i'm like you imagined me ya daft cunt, that's because I look just like you imagined me - yuv got no imagination" (paraphrase). Will leave final line to Welsh:
that c**t Nietzche was wide by the mark when he said I was deed. I'm naw deed, I just dinnae give a f**k'
Update: Big Boy informs me "I told him that I was an agnostic...but then you introduced me to the concept of Deist...that is what I am. He now knows that I am a deist."
Comments:
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thanks for the link and the edifying piece of information on agnosticism and deism. i actually fell (is that even an appropriate term?) into the label of agnostic. i have a decidedly neutral stance on religion and conceptualizations of god, but sometimes, even the distinction can be quite stifling. i just try to live what i know and what i believe is right. i don't believe they even have a socially accepted label for that at present.
Trans:
Happily surprised to see your quick comment. I can understand fell since I don't believe anyone chooses a religious belief - though I have a funny image of someone mulling over choosing a religion "well I don't care for fasting during Ramadan, Lent or Yom Kippur, but i like dropping bread crumbs in the water to expunge my sins on Rosh Hashona so I'll choose Judaism" - instead you realize your beliefs as I realized that I believed in God, but not in the organized religions (view the the various religious texts as the footsteps or embers of God.)
taryl
p.s. downloaded the "Sleeps with butterflies" after seeing you quote from it - fine song (have enjoyed Tori since i purchased "little earthquakes" years ago).
Happily surprised to see your quick comment. I can understand fell since I don't believe anyone chooses a religious belief - though I have a funny image of someone mulling over choosing a religion "well I don't care for fasting during Ramadan, Lent or Yom Kippur, but i like dropping bread crumbs in the water to expunge my sins on Rosh Hashona so I'll choose Judaism" - instead you realize your beliefs as I realized that I believed in God, but not in the organized religions (view the the various religious texts as the footsteps or embers of God.)
taryl
p.s. downloaded the "Sleeps with butterflies" after seeing you quote from it - fine song (have enjoyed Tori since i purchased "little earthquakes" years ago).
that's something to think about, of course. organized religion makes me horribly suspicious. a lot of people are too welcoming of an excuse for any institution to do their thinking for them. maybe they think it lessens responsibility? anyway, thanks for the space.
love that song by tori. i was actually listening to that when i was reading through someone's letters (which inspired the post). it clicked. glad you downloaded it. maybe you want to try casey stratton's for reasons unexplained. i love that song, too.
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love that song by tori. i was actually listening to that when i was reading through someone's letters (which inspired the post). it clicked. glad you downloaded it. maybe you want to try casey stratton's for reasons unexplained. i love that song, too.
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